Taken from "Moshable #18!" Features interviews with: The Cramps, Nashville Pussy, The Dirtys, The Hookers, Thee Headcoats, The Flaming Sideburns, The Pleasure Fuckers, The Coyote Men, The Ramones, D Generation, Super Roadie Biffen
(Hellacopters/Backyard Babies), Scooch Pooch Records, Gerard Damiano - The Felini of Porn, Zine Reviews, "Record-O-Rama" with over 300 record reviews plus a Dregen (Backyard Babies) pin-up!
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If you're a regular reader of this rag you know and worship The Godfather Of Lo-Fi R'n'R, Mr. Billy Childish, and his blokes in Thee Headcoats and for rookies: Childish is one of the most productive artists in rock'n'roll (100-150 albums) ever! Plus he's a respected writer and painter as well! I've always been jealous of Ole because he's seen 'em twice in London but finally I had the chance to catch them and Thee Headcoatees at Loppen, Christiania. Soundcheck noise and bad tape quality didn't help this interview but with the assistence of Childish-expert Jimmy Airguitar (of Electricity magazine) a pleasant long talk with a tea drinkin' Billy are now included in your favorite headbangin' magazine. Special thanks to Rikke and Brock (of Electricity) for deciphering the sacred words of the Earl of Suavedom.
Jens: It's your first time in Denmark?
BC: Yes.
Jimmy: Why?
BC: We've never really been invited before, that's it. A year or two ago Karl's (Copenhagen record label - Ed.) tried to organize one-off shows but we needed a couple. And we never really had agents and don't organize big tours or anything so it's never really come about.
Jimmy: You don't seem to tour outside of England?
BC: We don't tour in England at all. We tour more outside of England, we play in England once a month. And do occasional tours abroad. We've been big in Germany ever since we did the Milkshakes. And we've played Holland a bit with Thee Headcoats but it's never really been orginazised - we're not a very professional group. We don't do tours, we're too inaccurate. We used to do a lot of two-week stints but we never really worked with agents, that's not our style. We sort of do a couple of gigs - that's is. Then we're through and go home. I used to be a real drinker, used to drink a lot of whiskey. But now I don't at all. And we try to put real proper energy in to it. Whereas, if you do that with drugs or alcohol you can't do that every time. It's a bitch.
Jimmy: That's for sure.
Jens: Okay, your new album, "Messerschmitt.." is a bit more raw soundin' than "In Tweed We Trust"?
BC: Well, it was recorded live in four hours.
Jens: In your home?
BC: Yes. It's just recorded on a 1/2 track. We've got one microphone, we've got a 15 Watt Zolman with the vocal and guitar in it and one microphone between the bass guitar and the drum in a room this size (about 10 m2 - Ed.) (laughter).
Jimmy: That explains a lot!
Jens: I've thought this "1/2 track" thing was a joke. It's for real?
BC: That's exactly what we did all the backing tracks in The Milkshakes. If
we recorded it without the vocals, that means we could have the guitar loud
and we just... That's how we recorded most of The Mighty Caesars albums as
well - with an old rhythm box - and one microphone between the drums and
the bass and one guitar. If you wanna put vocals through this amplifier and
then the guitar has to become lower, then everything has to become quieter
and it's a very different quality. We did one album like that and it adds a
lot of character. The idea is really just to have the energy of playing it
because if we wanted to go through a recording studio, well then... But we
really didn't see the point (laughter).
Jimmy: What about, after all these years (over 20 years) in the music
business, how do you get the inspiration to keep on going?
BC: Well, as I said we don't play too often. And I work in other areas like
doing my painting and writing and get some inspiration from those areas.
And I like... I do like playing now and then, it's sort of like... because
we don't do it to excess, you know - it's exciting to do it.
Jimmy: So it keeps being exciting?
BC: Yeah, it's not to do it as a job. You know, if we did it as a job like
most groups do, you get sort of tired and you end up doing a different sort
of music, I suppose.
Jens: Is it the painting that pays the bills?
BC: No, it's the music a bit, the writing a bit, the painting a bit. And
that's the only things I lived off for the last two years. And previous to
that, I was just on the dole for about 13 years. The situation in England
has changed and it's very difficult when you're unemployed. In the end,
I've decided to try to do it on my own. But it's a little bit... it seems
OK, but we only ever see a month in advance that we can continue - the
other guys have jobs as well.
Jimmy: With all the records you put out, it's amazing to us, where do you
get all that energy from?
Jens: See all the grey hairs? (points to Jimmy) It's because he has to buy
all your albums (laughter).
Jimmy: You're responsable for a lot grey hairs of record collectors!
BC: Well, the energy for it, I suppose, a lot of it must be through my
neurotic background. And I've rescued lots of energy from that. And that's
where it all come from, I suppose. You know, from trying to work out a lot
of my own shit.
Jens: Do you go into a recording studio once a month?
BC: Oh no, I haven't been in recording studios for ages. What happens is,
if we have an album lying around that we can release, I have to put it in
order and if we're going to make an album, usually I just write the songs
and we go in and record the album as we intended and mix it the next day or
two days. And we don't rehearse either, I just run through the songs once
because we can't play a lot of that stuff live because we don't know it, we
just heard it once and recorded it. And I read the lyrics off and we record
it and never play it again, maybe... and then, if we want to do it as a
song we have to learn it! And then rehearse it before we go on a sound
check, that's the only way we learn these songs.
Jimmy: So I suppose your lyrics are mostly about personal experiences like
the Twist single; "Gun In My Father's Hand/The Day I Beat My Father". I
thought it was hilarious.
BC: "The Day..." is, I suppose, a straight-forward story about, you know...
and "Gun In..." is rather more of a metaphor about the very violent man he
was. I've had this idea about being killed by the father and "The Day..."
is a basic, straight story.
Jens: You're touring with Thee Headcoatees - what's the good and bad points
of that?
BC: Well, the bad points are... they get on my nerves a bit and it costs
more money to travel... I think that's it, really! We get on OK, generally.
Often they don't come with us because we can't afford to bring them as
well. We've had occasions when people have said "We just want Thee
Headcoatees" and we (Thee Headcoats - Ed.) said "Fine, take them! But who
is going to play for them?" (laughter). And some people come up to me very
proudly and say "Thee Headcoatees are better than Thee Headcoats" and I say
"Well, I'm in Thee Headcoatees!". But I don't think you realize that. And
even when people do come to see us, they really like to say "Thee
Headcoatees are better than Thee Headcoats" which is obviously rubbish!
(laughter). You get a lot of people who do believe that and then other
people ask me "Do Thee Headcoatess play their own instruments?" and I say
"The Headcoatees can't even tie their own fuckin' shoelaces!" (laughter).
Apart from that, we get on pretty good. Kira (Billy's wife - Ed.) has just
done an album on which Holly plays guitar and bass, sometimes.
Jimmy: She's also putting out solo albums.
BC: Yes, and she plays bass for us a bit. Kira's just done an album that we
do the backing for. It's just an album Kira did, so... A lot of that is
recorded live on the 1/2 track, as well.
Jimmy: Tell us about this headcoat thing. What's the story behind that?
BC: Oh, a headcoat is a deerstalker. I suppose with the Downliners Sect
(60's garage/R&B outfit of London - Ed.), Don Craine (singer of D.S. - Ed.)
is more of a deerstalker and in one of his songs, it sounds like he says:
"I took off my hat cause it was a deerstalker" and Bruce (of Headcoats -
Ed.) thought he said: "I took of my headcoat it was a deerstalker" and
after that we did a record with the Downliners Sect and I actually said to Don: "You don't say headcoat, do you? You said hat cause" and he said: "Yes, I said hat cause". So really, our name is THEE HAT CAUSES! (laughter).
Jens: Don's an honorary member of the Worshipful Order of Ancient Headcoats
(W.O.A.H), right?
BC: He is an honorary member of W.O.A.H. We told him he could be an
honorary member of W.O.A.H. and he said: "Thank you very much" (laughter)
We gave him a ceremonial deerstalker with one of our badges on it... we had
special blazer badges made in India! With gold threads, really nice. None
of us have got one like that but Don's got one of those. It's a mark of
respect.
Jimmy: Have you recorded more than one album as Thee Headcoat Sect?
BC: We did an EP with Don and then we did an album ("Deerstalking Men" -
Ed.) with Don and Keith Grant (bass player of D.S. - Ed.). We have been
talking about doing another LP with Don and Keith but we haven't gotten
around to it yet.
Jimmy: "Deerstalking Men" is a great album.
BC: But we want to do an album with covers - good R&B covers, just real
basic, like a Downliner sort-of-album and do R&B covers that they haven't
done, just nice and straight-forward. And we wanna do it before they pop
their clocks! (laughter).
Jens: Are there any new British bands you can recommend. What about The
Coyote Men?
BC: I don't know them. I like The Guaranteed Ugly (silly but fun 60's punk
- Ed.). We've played with them quite a bit. There are some groups I should
mention but I forget about them again. People ask me what kind of
comtemporary music I like and I did get across a couple, who I thought, oh,
they're pretty good but whenever anybody asks me my mind goes completely
blank. It's not much I've come into contact with, I don't often see groups
and we haven't had that many play with us. So, I don't really know.
Jimmy: So you mostly see bands who are on your bill?
BC: Usually we don't have groups to support us unless they use our
equipment and then, we don't let them use our equipment unless we know them
and we like them anyway... This situation with a support group with a big
rock set up is really odd. We wouldn't normally do that... We're doing as
we're told for a change tonight and that's what we're having, apparently.
Normally we just do our own shows. When we go abroad, we don't have
supports much... Because usually their drum kit alone is worth more than
everything we got (I'm positive that was the case with supporters On Trial
- Ed.) and then they want the whole back of the stage and everything miked
up - and we don't mike any back line and we don't use house P.A.'s. So we
end up playing around them. We use such old gear, we're just not a rock
group. I don't think there are any groups who are influenced by us or fans
of ours or in the same area, who play like us. They mike up the back line,
they mike up the drum kit.
Jimmy: A more traditional way to...
BC: No, not really.
Jimmy: That's depends...
BC: Yes, of your point of view of traditionality. Having control of the
sound and doing it ourselves as opposed to nowadays; the rock way/the rock
sound. Even though they do music that is not of that type, they want to
have 2-3.000 Kw of P.A., where as we have a 50 Watt P.A.
Jens: You've been touring the States. Have you ever met Hasil Adkins? You seem to have some of the same attitude.
BC: No, I haven't. I've heard some of his records but I've never met him.
We have not done a lot of touring in the States, we've been over a couple
times but we've never done it too extensively... We don't like to play too
much, it get's too tiring.
Jimmy: Better to stay home...
BC: We're going back to America this year but we're very... We just don't,
you know, with an agent, you know, in every place and every night. Like
tonight, we'll get to bed at 2 or 3 if we're lucky and have to get up
around 10 tomorrow - It's not my idea of fun! You see bands that do that
and get drunk every night and do it for couple of months but I'm fucked if
I will! Rock'n'Roll life is shit!! I'm not interested in hype and the drugs
and the whiskey and the bullshit. (laughter) I like a nice quiet evening
indoors with a cup of tea...
Jens: You've tried the wild life?
BC: I've had a few beers along the way... (laughter)
Jens: Who's Johnny and what happened to Tub (drummer -
Ed.)?
BC: Johnny is Tub.
Jimmy: So you have a really steady line-up?
BC: Yeah, we've been playing about 6 years now... I'm not sure.
Jens: You seem to have mixed emotions about The Clash?
BC: No, not really, I just like their first album and nothing else. I like
a couple of things after that.
Jimmy: What about The Stash single?
BC: It's one of those ideas you get at night and if you're sensible you
forget about it and don't do it. But because we record so quickly, we just
did it. I mean, I just don't like the idea of them (The Clash) advertising
Levi's and singing "I'm So Bored With U.S.A."
Jimmy: Suddenly they strike it big.
BC: Mike Post said that Punk Rock was finished when The Clash signed to CBS
in March '77. (laughter) The Stash was just a bit of fun.
Jimmy: You've rerecorded "We Hate The Fucking N.M.E." (and who doesn't hate
that trendy piece of shite - Ed.).
BC: The original wasn't recorded live, I thought it would better if it had
been.
Jens: Okay, "Rock'n'Roll and Poetry"!? That's something you don't see every
day. You get to meet a lot of different people?
BC: A lot of different people, maybe. You get a lot of cross-over, a lot of
people who like my poems don't generally like poetry. But I'm happy to meet
different people in different areas. Good rock'n'roll has alot to do with
poetry - good poetry can have a lot to do with good rock'n'roll. Really,
you have the same attitude. The thing is with poetry, like, rock'n'roll
communicates on one level and poetry on another. And it can be that it is
good. I mean, a lot of poetry isn't good but a lot of music isn't good. The
way it is about poetry, is that you can sometimes touch a much deeper level.
Jens: I would imagine Charles Bukowski was an inspiration.
BC: Yeah, I really like Bukowski when I was in my early 20's, late teens. I
really thought he was quite stunning.
(Billy talks about Jimi Hendrix and Bukowski, and how booze and drugs get
to be the image and more important than the artist himself - Ed.)
BC: You know, "Ham On Rye" is an excellent novel, and "Post Office" is
really, really good. I like Bukowski best when he's sensitive and
intelligent, and least of all, what he is more famous for, being borish and
dull - this hard-drinking, hardliving shit. It can be a big inspiration to
a kid in some ways but it's pretty hollow in the end. And it doesn't
impress me. I think there's a lot more to it than that. It's a shame that's
what the hype is. And maybe it's OK to write that, I get bored and I find
something else.
Jimmy: Are you at all interested in politics? What do you thing of the new
labour government in England?
BC: I prefer Margaret Thatcher! She is what she is. Which I can deal with a
lot easier than this so-called socialism. He (Tony Blair - P.M. and
Oasis-fan - Ed.) is a careerist, I think. A slimeball. I prefer, I guess,
some social and christian ethics would be what I'd like. Sort of trying to
treat people decently. I'm not political. People say "Tony is generous and
nice", I say "No, he's an uptight cunt!". And you can say that about a lot
of politicians.
Jimmy: That's sounds reasonable.
BC: It's a human condition, I think, people just get the governments and
politicians that we deserve. I mean, people are very selfish. They're
greedy - or we are. It's a bastard running things for bastard!
Jens: Speaking of bastards, there's a big focus on the Britpop scene and
you wrote a song called "We Hate The Fucking N.M.E.". Do you feel any
connection with...
BC: Well, I think that we said it best in that song. Oasis and the Daily
Star deserve each other. It's a pathetic attempt to recall Britannia, you
know, saving England with their art and music. I think "Abbey Road" was bad
enough done by the Beatles and then to be redone again worse by Oasis -
it's sort of wrong. They have these charts in England, "Best 100 Albums Of
All Time" and, apparently, "Sgt. Pepper" was no. 1. When I was a kid , we
had all of the Beatles records, and I was about 8 or 9 when "Sgt. Pepper"
came out. I liked "Sgt. Pepper" when I was 7-8 , I had that album. I
thought it was a really great and for me, emotionally, it really takes me
back to my childhood. It makes me feel secure and nice and I like it. But I
don't think it's their greatest album - I think it's their greatest defeat!
I mean, by 1967 the Beatles had managed to reduce themselves from being a
vital rock'n'roll group, playing at the Star Club, into turning rock'n'roll
into total boredom. By 1968 even your grandmother liked it. It was so far
less sophisticated than it wants to appear. I understand why the Beatles
did it, and why they did "Abbey Road" and all of this. They had to, I
supposed. But why someone as talentless as Oasis, this is really
unbelievable. And people want to applaud it, as well, those people really
just want the most trivial rubbish!
Jens: I could imagine you're a big Kinks fan?
BC: Yeah, I like the early Kinks a lot. I like the Kinks' first 3 albums, I
like the Stones' first 3 albums, the Pretty Things first 3 albums, and once
you get up to Punk Rock, it seems like bands only make one good record.
After that they're finished. But earlier on, before... I mean, if you go
back to Bo Diddly, he could do 6 good albums, John Lee Hooker could do 20
good albums. Their careers and their inspiration stayed the same. The
elemental elements - it was quite extended before they faded out. But I
think that I like to work at a record, like, this could be a good first
album. I don't want it to develop - I don't believe in evolution, I believe
in de-evolution. I think cars should be de-evolutionized so you get smaller
units, organic food and organic music, organic everything. There is so much
shit in the world. I know it's not gonna happen. We, Thee Headcoats, are
against the E.E.C. but I like the borders coming down. But anyway it's just
a big commerciel vehicle for politics and commerce, they always go hand in
hand. Politicians should go back to politics and not do commerce. Commerce
doesn't care about people. Maybe some briallant religious renaissance,
that's what people need, something's needed for people - not fuckin'
politics! People need God, I suppose. I don't know what one, though.
(laughter) But it's not the fucking God of television and money.
Jens: You talk about keeping things simple and there seems to be a lo-fi
explosion in rock. And you may be a big inspiration, do you think it's just
a new trend or...?
BC: I don't really understand it, and I don't know much about those bands
feeling that way... being inspired by Thee Headcoats. But our group, it's
not lo-fi it's hi-fi! What we're doing is trying to represent the energy in
the sound of what we do. We're interested in the sound. Like most
rock'n'roll is considered hi-fi, it's really just some made up synthesized
thing. I think that cassette-players have a more realistic representation
than most MTV-tracks. I'm more interested in the excitement you get out of
sound. In the embellishments and techniques in painting or drawing you can
use lots of energy and thick lines and put lots of power into it, and
that's OK. And you say "that's really good", it's got the expression. But
in music there has to be a certain way and it would the same as in
painting, as if saying; airbrush is beautiful and everything else is shit!
Like, if sound is colour; then everything is supposed to beige. But if you
listen to early recordings like early exciting music like early Hooker,
early Bo Diddly, they sound much more confrontational, much more
experimental, emotional and dangerous than comtemporary music does. They,
Hooker and Bo Diddly, have full ranges of sound and colour going on...
That's what I think!